Looking for a later summer bedtime...

Summer is here and school's are officially closed...no more alarms, no more rushing to get into school before the gates/door close, or cajoling (begging) little people to wear sun cream and a hat. At last we can have a little bit more flexibility!

how to help children sleep later

 

Of course if you are a working parent, you will still have some timelines to work to, but perhaps you would like to have a little more family time in the evening, and a slightly later wake up without school to rush to?

If so, then there is an easy way to add half an hour to your child's routine - IF they are sleeping well already.  If your child is early waking OR you are looking for help with a sleep issue, then you should have a read here  first, there may be other aspects that need looking at first.

**warning** For children with sleep issues, later bedtimes do NOT always stop early waking - in fact in some cases it can actually make it worse!

OK, lets assume your child is sleeping through and you just want that extra time... and that by having your child wake up half an hour later you will not be delayed for work-  then simply add 10 minutes to your child's usual bedtime every  two or three days. Go slowly and let them adapt and within the week you have your extra half an hour for summer :-)

The week before school starts in September, do the same in reverse to get back to "school" bedtime....but let's not think about that for now! :-)

Take care, and sleep well

Claire

x

 

Circadian Rhythms

A fascinating segment recently on Radio 4, discussed the impact and importance of circadian rhythm's(what we may describe as the body clock when referring to sleep) however they are not just present in our sleep.

"These rhythms are generated within organisms and also in response to external stimuli, mainly light and darkness. They are found throughout the living world, from bacteria to plants, fungi to animals and, in humans, are noticed most clearly in sleep patterns" 

A link is provided below for you to listen to the full segment

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b06rzd44?ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbc_radio_4&ns_linkname=radio_and_music

 

Is bedwetting disturbing your child's sleep?

If your child's sleep is being disturbed by bedwetting there are some practical steps that you can take, however it's also worth remembering that bedwetting even in older children is common, and sometimes children may just not be "ready"

One mum told us "My daughter didn't come out of daytime nappies until she was 3 (literally as she started mornings at nursery) she is now 4 and half and still in nighttime nappies. Although we have had the very occasional dry night, more often than not her nappy is wet is night, however it's probably the only thing I have been relaxed about - as long as she is comfortable, happy and sleeping, I do not feel in a major rush"

Approximately one in five children of 4 and a half years wets the bed at least once a week, according to the National Institute for Health and Care Excellence (NICE)*

We thought it might be useful to provide the Sheffield Children's Trust advice on bedwetting  - see below.

(You may  also want to take a look at the NHS choices guidelines on bedwetting)

 

1. Bedwetting is a common problem affecting 1 in 10 children at the age of 7 years.

2. One of the most important things to check is whether your child is drinking enough during the day. 6 – 8 drinks (around 200mls each) of clear fluids evenly spread through the day are important to make sure bladder capacity is sufficient to hold all the urine made overnight.

3. Lifting your child to go to the toilet while still asleep may not be a good idea as it may be

training them to wee while asleep.

4. Waking them to have a wee a couple of hours or so after they have gone to sleep may be sufficient to keep them dry by morning but it's best not to do this for long periods. The

bladder needs practice to grow to hold all the overnight wee.

5. Do encourage your child to take control of weeing during the day, especially if they are

leaving it to the last minute and are often caught short while playing or in lessons.

Planning ahead is a good thing to learn and increase their focus on their bladder that is

going to help at night.

6. Try to avoid fizzy, caffeine or blackcurrant drinks.

7. Reduce drinks of any sort in the 2 hour period before bed – but don’t let your child go

thirsty.

8. Encourage your child to wee twice at bedtime, once before getting ready for bed and

again before going to sleep.

9. If your child is in pull-ups, do try them without for a week or so every 3 months – especially if they are becoming drier.

10. If your child is dry for around 50% of nights, reward charts for dry nights can be helpful for short spells. Do not continue if there are no signs of progress.

11. If your child is still frequently wet at night by the age of 7, it is still worth seeing if other

forms of treatment will help, such as various medicines or enuresis alarms. Do see your GP/ school nurse tMore information is available at ERIC the UK childhood Continence Charity* NICE guidance cg1

If you would like help with your child's sleep, please contact us

Please bear in mind, this is general advice, and if you have any concerns about your child's physical or emotional welbeing you should always seek professional medical advice immediately.

Tagged: bed wettingwet the beddry at nightdry nights,stopping nappieswoken by wetting the bed

Sleep, Cognition and Behavioral Problems in School Age Children.

Sleep, Cognition, and  Behavioral Problems in School-Age Children: A Century of Research Meta-Analyzed

Rebecca G. Astill Netherlands Institute for Neuroscience Kristiaan B. Van der Heijden Leiden University Marinus H. Van IJzendoorn Leiden University and Erasmus University Rotterdam Eus J. W. Van Someren Netherlands Institute for Neuroscience, and VU University & Medical Centre

 Please read the full study by clicking on this link

 

 

How food could affect your child's sleep

Could food be affecting your child's sleep? Here is some information about the Super-Hero Sleepy Foods and the not so good, NON-Sleepy Foods that may have a negative impact around sleep time.

School holiday's and special times like Halloween, may mean that no matter how much you might to try to  monitor sugar and other "treats" on an every day basis, your child's intake may increase during these seasonal few weeks.

Sugar at any time of year (not just Halloween)  may make absolutely no difference at all  to your child's sleep, but for other's (who's parents may feel are more "sugar sensitive" ) it could have some affects. 

 

 

What are Sleepy Foods?

 Sleepy foods are the ones that contain Tryptophan. This is an amino acid that is only found in our diet. It is required by our body as part of the eventual production of melatonin - the hormone that produces our sleep/wake cycles.

  • Our body uses the  Tryptophan to produce serotonin.

  • Serotonin is used to make melatonin  

Foods to avoid are the ones that may wake us up by providing a "boost" of energy at exactly the wrong time!

Below is a quick overview  of "sleepy foods"  that contain our good friend Tryptophan, as well as a list of some foods to consider avoiding around sleep time.

 Good Sleepy Foods

Lets start with teatime - opt for brown rice, barley, grains (such as Spelt), and sweet potatoes. These are all better options than their white refined cousins.

Chicken, turkey, cod, tuna, mackerel, and salmon are all sleepy foods, and contrary to popular belief - cheese is also on our list. Go for cheddar, processed cheese, cottage cheese and even tofu.

When picking the vegetables for tea, you could include spinach, asparagus, green peas, broccoli, tomatoes, cabbage, cauliflower, mushrooms, cucumbers and potatoes and know that they will all be excellent "sleepy food" choices. Other teatime options are mung bean, soybeans, kidney beans, lima beans, and chickpeas – so humous is good.

Bedtime cereals should be sugar free and "plain". Choose  Weetabix, shredded wheat or porridge. You could even try sprinkling a little ground flax seed on (if you can get away with it!) Or if your child prefers a slice of toast for supper, then aim for whole wheat bread.

In the dairy corner, warm full fat milk, yogurt and soya milk can be via a drink or accompanied with cereal, and in the fruit bowl - apples, bananas, blueberries, strawberries,  peaches, and cherries are good - in fact, cherries actually contain melatonin, so they are pretty high on the list!

Nuts are an option for children who are old enough (and allergy free) and who perhaps do not feel like a "proper" supper - unsalted walnuts, peanuts, cashews, pistachios, chestnuts and almonds are good choices, and sesame, pumpkin and sunflower seeds offer other night time snack choices.

Foods to Avoid 

Foods containing caffeine and high levels of sugar should ideally be avoided for 4 to 6 hours before bedtime. This includes all kinds of chocolate, tea, coffee and cola drinks. 

Biscuits, sugary sweets and high sugar yogurts are all better eaten earlier in the day if possible, as they could actually give a boost of energy at just the wrong time! Fizzy drinks may contain chemicals , as well as  sugar, so these are best avoided - if not altogether, then definitely from lunchtime. 

Finally

Enjoy the School Holiday's and Happy Halloween!!

Does your child have sleep issues? Please contact us for a free initial assessment, without any obligation. 

How to help your child cope with the clocks changing

Some children cope very easily with time changes, and adapt after just a few days.

However, if you would prefer to avoid any hint of bedtime battles, there is an easy step-by-step approach to move your child's bedtime later, in preparation for when the clocks change on 25th Oct 2015.

coping with the clocks changing

 

 

The key is planning ahead, and taking things slowly.

Starting from today, delay your child's bedtime by five minutes only.

Stick with this time for one or two nights before moving another five minutes, so they are now going to bed ten minutes later than usual. Continue to move your child's sleep time by five minutes each night (or two).

Remember you know your child bestso if five minutes each night is achievable then great, but feel free to wait two, or even three nights before adding on another fiveminutes  to meet the needs of your child, 

If your child still naps in the daytime, move the nap the same way at the same time, so everything is shuffling very slightly, and very gently, later and later.

After a week or two of moving five minutes at the rate you chose, your child will soon be going to sleep one hour later than their usual bedtime. The clock will then "fall back" on the 25th of October -  and your child will be back to their normal bedtime.

Good luck, and sleep well

 

Read how we helped one family get the sleep they deserve

One of our previous clients share's their own experiences and reason's on why they chose to work with Child Sleep Support. 

What challenges were you facing before receiving support? 

We were getting night waking. Our little boy 'J'  (aged 3 years) was getting into bed with us frequently. We were OK with this at first and happy for him to sleep with us if he wanted, however he would keep us awake as he moves quite a lot in his sleep and with a new baby imminent it became apparent we could not continue in this way. 

The bigger challenge however was early waking. J would wake up around 5am and get up for the day even though he was obviously still tired. Most days J would refuse to go back to sleep and then he would be cranky, clingy and teary all day. On occasion we could get him to sleep for another 1-2 hours and these days he was a notably different child.

Our own wellbeing was also suffering as we would often be awake in the night with J getting into bed with us and then being awake for the day from around 5am. It was particularly upsetting when I found myself being impatient with J and sometimes shouting at him because we were both tired and upset. The thought of being up through the night nursing a newborn and then spending all day with a grumpy, clingy toddler was causing further stress

Had you ever considered getting professional help before?

No. We were never bought into “sleep training” as we thought that meant controlled crying or cry it out and that didn’t fit in with our parenting style. We believed that staying with him whilst he fell asleep and allowing him to get into bed with us made him feel safe and secure and, whilst that was true, it was also having negative effects on all of us

How did you find the written sleep programme.

Very easy to understand and the right amount of detail

How did you find the phone & email support?

Great. Claire was there whenever we needed her

How quickly did first start to see results

Within a couple of days, much quicker than expected

What is the situation now

Things are great now. We can say goodnight to J and leave him to fall asleep on his own. He does this quickly – usually within minutes! which is much quicker than when we used to sit in his room with him which was more like 30 minutes on a good day

J now is able to stay in his own room all night and doesn’t come into our bed any more. However if something is wrong (he is cold, in pain, thirsty) he knows he can wake us by coming in or shouting for one of us.

The early waking is gone. J generally wakes up 6:30-7 now. He is a much happier child as a result

What really helped you?

Having some structure. I think we knew what we needed to do deep down but needed someone to reassure us that it was the right thing to do and help us do it in the right way

Tell us what you thought about your sleep practitioner

Claire is great, and took a lot of time to really understand our routines, needs and where we wanted to be. The key “selling point” for us getting the help from Child Sleep Support was that Claire didn’t tell us what the issues were with our routine – something that puts me off the celebrity sleep training experts like Gina Ford or Jo Frost – but she acknowledged that things were only problems if we thought they were and that anything we were happy with should remain the same.

Is there anything that we could improve on

Nothing that springs to mind!

What would you say to a family who are considering using our services

You should definitely speak to someone at Child Sleep Support to see if they can offer you the help you need. We now have a quick and easy bedtime and a full night’s sleep every night and as a result we are all happier and enjoy our days together much more than we did before. We can’t thank Claire enough for the help and support she has given us

If your child has sleep issues, please feel free to contact us without any obligation, to see how we can help you.

Sleep Associations

Trying to remove a sleep association from a child 12 months or older, can seem daunting. You may have spent years trying to "wean" something, but with planning, patience and kindness, it usually can be done. Of course not all sleep associations cause issues, but if you would like to remove something, here are a few tips that may help you support your child

First of all be prepared. Do not expect changes overnight, a habit takes at least two weeks to change (and sometimes longer) so be kind to yourself -  and to your child. You will get there.

  • Make a plan for the best time to begin. 
  • Avoid illness, teething, or when there is a change of circumstances - these are times when your child needs comfort.
  • Also to be avoided are times such as when you have a deadline at work (you will probably be even more tired than usual for a while) if your child is just starting school , or is expected to be up early for nursery. 
  • School holidays are often a good time (if it works for you)
  • Know that it will be hard at first, but you will get there, but only if you are consistent, patient and understanding.

Using other sleep associations to get you over the bumpy first few days may be a way to ease the transition for your child, but only use them as you need them  (this is key)

As soon as your child is OK with one step, move onto the next one. Don't rush, but do not linger. E.g you may rock your child initially for 2 to 3 days, but then move onto just holding in your arms for 2-3 days and so on.

Replicate your plan for naps and bedtime as appropriate.

You may need to get creative to think around your child's particular needs. Remember what work's for one child, may not work for another. This is why we design our Child Sleep Packages individually.

Removing a sleep association is a little like turning the volume down on the TV. Spend 2-3 days at one level, before going one "notch" down.

The key is to put a long term plan in place.

You may find after reading this that you would like a supportive sleep plan , or have a question about your current situation.  Please feel free to contact us for a confidential chat.

Please note that this article relates broadly to sleep management of children 12 months and older, and does not constitute or replace medical advice. Clients are advised to take treatments, council or therapy from the  professionals in the appropriate disciplines.

Helping children with cope with jet lag and time zone changes

If you are going on a long-haul holiday this year, or to a destination with a time difference, you may be wondering how your child will adjust their sleep times. Here are a couple of options  to help them adapt to the destination time-zone, and then back again when you return home.

Helping children with jetlag

Moving your child's sleep time before you go.

  • Work out your destination time difference by 5 minutes (eg. One hour would be 12 x 5 minutes)
  • Once you can see how many days you need to get to your desired time, start moving everything 5 minutes earlier or later (as required) This includes naps, meals -everything.
  • Do not move things anymore than 5 minutes per day, as it may be too much of a jump and cause issues. 
  • Eventually you will be at your desired time (Yippee)

Changing time zone's when you arrive at your destination.

Upon arrival try to adapt to local times as much as possible. This may mean you need to juggle nap times to try and fit in.  Be prepared (and realistic) expect 3 to 4 "bumpy" nights, but things will soon settle down.

When you get home

  • Settle your child back into their "usual routine" immediately upon arrival home.  
  • Aim for naps and sleeps in your child's own bed or cot where possible.
  • After 3 to 4 days things should be looking more settled.

 

For one to one help with sleep issues, please contact us

Don't forget, you can receive our blog post's direct by subscribing below.

 

Holiday Sleep Tips

If you are going away this summer, here are some tips that may your child sleep better in a holiday environment. 

Routine Yes, 'try' and keep on track with nap's and bedtimes, but don't become obsessed, after all this is your holiday too, so be realistic.

Aim to ensure your child is getting enough sleep in total. Trust your instincts. If your child is sleep deprived and becoming grouchy - it probably won't be much fun for them or you! You may need to be creative and flexible to provide sleep opportunities for them.

Late Nights -  If you know for a fact older children will be staying up later -  think about introducing an afternoon nap to 'top them up' They may resist you at first, but hide it under the guise of "staying out of the sun"  Switch of all screens, and the TV, and instead do some some colouring. Play some white noise and relax. If this is a no-go, perhaps plan your nights with the one night out, one night in approach .This will allow an early or regular bedtime, so your child can catch up. A wee afternoon cruise around in hire car can also "facilitate" a little nap.

Hotel Room - Contact your holiday company, and ask if the property has shutter's or blackout blinds for the windows. Some tourist areas even have  hire companies that can provide what you need (this is where google is a godsend!) Sunlight is  a big trigger for early waking, and knowing that the pool/beach is just minutes away, can sometimes be an irresistible wake-up call for young (and not so young!) children. If you are unable to loan/hire blackouts, it may be worth sacrificing a few pairs of shoes of suitcase weight allowance in exchange for travel style blackout blind (but do check the weight, as you don't want to be over the limit)

Noise - Download a white noise app onto your phone or Ipod, you can spend a few nights gently introducing it at home, so you (and your little one) are used to it. This may help if accommodation noise is proving distracting. If you are all in one room/environment pick something you will all like :-) If you choose your phone, remember this may mean that you cannot access your phone post-bedtime/nap, and pack your charger as it may mean a battery drain.

Buggy Naps/sleeps. Specifically designed shades for your buggy (such as a Snoozeshade) can be a a good idea. Not only are they breathable, but they often provide sun protection. They also give your child a chance to 'switch off' and prevent well meaning people from peering in to say 'hello' just as your child is dropping off! Please please never use a cloth draped over the buggy -  it may inhibit airflow at and may 'hold' heat in. Please purchase  a correct buggy shade system.

When You Get Home - If thing's do go a little haywire on holiday- don't worry. When you arrive home, go immediately back to your usual nap/bedtime routine. Aim to have your child having bedtimes/naps at home in their own bed and stick to your routine like glue, After 3-7 days things should be back to normal, or you can contact us for one to one support. 

Next week - How to overcome jet lag and time differences when traveling. Subscribe below to receive it direct by email.

Is your child getting enough sleep?

If you are concerned about your child's sleep, one of your questions may be "How much sleep is the right amount?"

With this in mind, we thought it might be helpful to show the average amount hours of sleep a child should roughly be aiming for, based on their age. 

Remember this is a guideline, and all children's needs and circumstances will differ. We tailor our work specifically to each child we support, and we appreciate and respect that parents know their children best.

You may also consider the below points, when assessing your child's sleep.

Average hours sleep a child needs

 

  • Does your child wake grumpy and/or upset?
  • Are they waking through the night?
  • Are they waking too early?
  • Does your child need a nap quite soon after waking up, or perhaps outside of the usual nap range?
  • Do they seem to "not need" sleep?
  • Can you see a difference in behaviour/energy levels when they have had a  longer night's sleep?

We can help your child get the amount of sleep they need, by providing one to one support

Average Number of Hours Sleep Needed 

Age                                 Night–time                                  Daytime Nap

12 months                            11 ½                                               2 ½

2 Years                                  11 ¾                                               1 ¼

3 Years                                  11                                                   1

4 Years                                  11 ½                                               The nap has usually gone at 4

5 Years                                  11                                                  -

6 Years                                  10 ¾                                              -

7 years                                  10 ½   

8 years                                  10 ¼   

9 years                                  10   

10 years                               9 ¾   

11 years                               9 ½   

12 years                               9 ½   

13 years                               9 ¼   

14 years                               9   

15 years                               8 ¾ 

16 years                              8 ½ 

Contact us anytime if you would like us to support your child's sleep.

Don't forget to subscribe (below) to receive our next blog post by email.

 

Link to published research in the BMJ - The impact of behavioural sleep intervention, on symptoms and sleep in children with attention deficit hyperactivity disorder and parental mental health

This is link to research conducted in 21 general paediatric practices in Victoria, Australia. The participants were 244 children aged 5-12 years with ADHD attending the practices between 2010 and 2012. it was published in the BMJ on the 20th January 2015 (BMJ 2015;350:h68 )  

Read the full research  HERE

If you would like help supporting your child's sleep, please feel free to contact us.

Bedwetting

Are you concerned about your child's bedwetting?

Approximately one in five children of 4 and a half years wets the bed at least once a week, according to the National Institute for Health and Care Excellence (NICE)*

If your child's sleep (and yours) is being disturbed by bedwetting there are some practical steps that you can take. We thought it might be useful to provide the Sheffield Children's Trust advice on bedwetting  - see below.

(You may  also want to take a look at the NHS choices guidelines on bedwetting)

1. Bedwetting is a common problem affecting 1 in 10 children at the age of 7 years.

2. One of the most important things to check is whether your child is drinking enough during the day. 6 – 8 drinks (around 200mls each) of clear fluids evenly spread through the day are important to make sure bladder capacity is sufficient to hold all the urine made overnight.

3. Lifting your child to go to the toilet while still asleep may not be a good idea as it may be

training them to wee while asleep.

4. Waking them to have a wee a couple of hours or so after they have gone to sleep may be sufficient to keep them dry by morning but it's best not to do this for long periods. The

bladder needs practice to grow to hold all the overnight wee.

5. Do encourage your child to take control of weeing during the day, especially if they are

leaving it to the last minute and are often caught short while playing or in lessons.

Planning ahead is a good thing to learn and increase their focus on their bladder that is

going to help at night.

6. Try to avoid fizzy, caffeine or blackcurrant drinks.

7. Reduce drinks of any sort in the 2 hour period before bed – but don’t let your child go

thirsty.

8. Encourage your child to wee twice at bedtime, once before getting ready for bed and

again before going to sleep.

9. If your child is in pull-ups, do try them without for a week or so every 3 months – especially if they are becoming drier.

10. If your child is dry for around 50% of nights, reward charts for dry nights can be helpful for short spells. Do not continue if there are no signs of progress.

11. If your child is still frequently wet at night by the age of 7, it is still worth seeing if other

forms of treatment will help, such as various medicines or enuresis alarms. Do see your GP/ school nurse to discuss this.

 

More information is available at ERIC the UK childhood Continence Charity.

* NICE guidance cg111

If you would like help with your child's sleep, please contact us

Please bear in mind, this is general advice, and if you have any concerns about your child's physical or emotional welbeing you should always seek professional medical advice immediately.

Why we dislike the term Sleep Training

We find the term sleep training too tough...

 Sleep training sounds like you and your child are heading to sleep boot camp.  "lay down in that bed and give me 12 hours."

 It is NOT how we work, because that is not how children and their families work.

 We prefer the terms sleep support (hence our name) sleep therapy, sleep coaching ,or maybe even sleep mentoring - but who would put that into google?

Quite honestly we keep the term " sleep training" in our content purely  because that is how most people "search" online - and we want to be found.

 Sleep training is not for us, because that's us "telling"  people something. We are passionate about working "with" families,  and "sharing" our knowledge and skills to empower parents and restore confidence and balance to sleep time for children and their families, without children being left  to cry alone.

sleep training

 However you say it, and whenever you do it - remember that supporting your child with sleep should always fit your parenting style. 

 Take care.

Foods that promote sleep

FOOD CAN PLAY A HUGE PART IN ASSISTING AND PROMOTING SLEEP, OR NEGATIVELY AFFECTING IT

  Sleepy foods are the ones that contain Tryptophan. This is an amino acid that is only found in our diet. It is required by our body as part of the eventual production of melatonin - the hormone that produces our sleep/wake cycles.

  • Our body uses the  Tryptophan to produce serotonin.

  • Serotonin is used to make melatonin  

Foods to avoid are the ones that may wake us up by providing a "boost" of energy at exactly the wrong time!

Below is a quick overview  of "sleepy foods"  that contain our good friend Tryptophan, as well as a list of some "foods to avoid"

 Good Sleepy Foods

Lets start with teatime - opt for brown rice, barley, grains (such as Spelt), and sweet potatoes. These are all better options than their white refined cousins.

Chicken, turkey, cod, tuna, mackerel, and salmon are all sleepy foods, and contrary to popular belief - cheese is also on our list. Go for cheddar, processed cheese, cottage cheese and even tofu.

When picking the vegetables for tea, you could include spinach, asparagus, green peas, broccoli, tomatoes, cabbage, cauliflower, mushrooms, cucumbers and potatoes and know that they will all be excellent "sleepy food" choices. Other teatime options are mung bean, soybeans, kidney beans, lima beans, and chickpeas – so humous is good.

Bedtime cereals should be sugar free and "plain". Choose  Weetabix, shredded wheat or porridge. You could even try sprinkling a little ground flax seed on (if you can get away with it!) Or if your child prefers a slice of toast for supper, then aim for whole wheat bread.

In the dairy corner, warm full fat milk, yogurt and soya milk can be via a drink or accompanied with cereal, and in the fruit bowl - apples, bananas, blueberries, strawberries,  peaches, and cherries are good - in fact, cherries actually contain melatonin, so they are pretty high on the list!

Nuts are an option for children who are old enough (and allergy free) and who perhaps do not feel like a "proper" supper - unsalted walnuts, peanuts, cashews, pistachios, chestnuts and almonds are good choices, and sesame, pumpkin and sunflower seeds offer other nightime snack choices.

Foods to Avoid

Foods containing caffeine and high levels of sugar should be avoided for 4 to 6 hours before bedtime. This includes all kinds of chocolate, tea, coffee and cola drinks. 

Biscuits, sugary sweets and high sugar yogurts are all better eaten earlier in the day, as they could actually give a boost of energy! Fizzy drinks  may contain chemicals , as well as  sugar, so these are best avoided - if not altogether, then definitely from lunchtime.